This essay is contained in my new book. I'm delighted to announce that The Sojourner's Passport site has launched! You can visit it at http://www.sojournerspassport.com/.
Everyone, I can't thank you enough for your ongoing encouragement and support; I truly appreciate it. Your support is what made this possible. And here's a special shout-out to my web designers at Educo Web Design. They're nice people to deal with, and they do outstanding work!
Peace and blessings,
Khadija Nassif
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61 comments:
(sighing) Khadija, so many of these issues--whether it's AAs, bw, or other oppressed people-- revolve around people not being shrewd enough and/or having the WILL to demand reciprocity from the getgo. If an individual or a group doesn't demand reciprocity in their dealings with others from- the-very-beginning-of-the- interaction, the other person or group is going to discount you and pretty soon, your needs are not even going to be thought about by the others. They will actually think you're attacking them when you make a request. LOL! In effect you have trained them to treat you as a less-than because you have ***rewarded*** their mistreatment of you. It is always wise to assume that people are not going to be nice or fair to you automatically; you must train them by demanding reciprocity as soon as possible.
And for bw who are constantly being accused of being shrill or having "attitudes," you don't have to be loud or aggressive to demand reciprocity. You can do so in a soft voice and with a smile on your face. You just have to tell people what you require and if they don't give it to you, there must be a consequence.
This means that you must always be as flawless as possible in your appearance, health, fitness, emotions, education, job skills, financial state, etc. I've never had to take nonsense from folks or only for a minute because I've made myself flawless enough to be able to close the door on them if they didn't honor my requests.
I'm not strong on Christian doctrine but I recall a biblical scripture that talks about (paraphrasing here) the need to train a child while young because if not the child will later on break before they bend. I've always interpreted that broadly to mean ANY SITUATION OR PERSON(S).
Lots of women in the world don't demand reciprocity from men because it's built into these patriarchial-driven societies for women to cater to men, however the main difference between those cultures/societies and that of AAs is that those cultures have an amount of reciprocity (though not nearly enough) built in for the women, whereas AA culture lacks that built-in piece totally and completely now.
The fact is that many men in traditional cultures and even some in so-called modern cultures believe that they OWN women. The man sees his status defined to a greater or lesser extent by the woman, so they won't allow a woman (who they consider to be a less-than thing anyway) to leave.
Many women absolutely do not understand men. SMH If I got to the point where I needed to get an order of protection, I would also get a weapon and prepare myself to use it. He might succeed in killing me, but I wouldn't go out like a sitting duck.
Cosigning that it's very dangerous for third parties to get involved in DV disputes. There was a case in PA a few months ago where a Hispanic man killed his sister-in-law for her interference in his ongoing beatings of his wife (the dead woman's sister). Anyway, this was also gruesome because he carried the dead woman's body around for several days in the trunk of his car.
He's in prison now, but his wife (who allowed him to beat her) is still alive and probably with another man by now while her sister is in the ground.
Very young girls need empowerment training badly because later on, these issues are so firmly rooted in these women until they become like victims waiting for their accident.
Greetings, Evia!
You said, "(sighing) Khadija, so many of these issues--whether it's AAs, bw, or other oppressed people-- revolve around people not being shrewd enough and/or having the WILL to demand reciprocity from the getgo.
If an individual or a group doesn't demand reciprocity in their dealings with others from- the-very-beginning-of-the- interaction, the other person or group is going to discount you and pretty soon, your needs are not even going to be thought about by the others. They will actually think you're attacking them when you make a request."
Absolutely correct. I've represented literally hundreds of abusive men. These men are NOT brave. They gradually "test" and "interview" women to see how much they can get away with. They do this by gradually escalating their controlling and disrespectful behavior. If a guy breaks out with violence immediately, the risks to him are just too great.
Before he beats a woman, this type of male tries to confirm that he's not dealing with the type of woman that might put a bullet in his brain, or pour boiling water on his head while he's asleep.
You said, "In effect you have trained them to treat you as a less-than because you have ***rewarded*** their mistreatment of you. It is always wise to assume that people are not going to be nice or fair to you automatically; you must train them by demanding reciprocity as soon as possible."
Correct. My abusive male clients don't mistreat every single woman they are involved with. They abuse the women who let them abuse them. They abuse the women who cotinue through the abuse-interview-process.
This is why it is so critical for women to drop a guy at the FIRST hint of controlling, disrespectful behavior. If you keep dealing with him after he's "shown out," you have (in his mind) given him PERMISSION to continue and escalate that behavior. Once you've stuck with him that far through the process, then you really will need a gun AND a SWAT team to get away from him.
But women are often raised to be foolish: "He didn't mean it like that...We're getting counseling and help...They're (Good Samaritan Rescuers) just jealous of our relationship...yadda, yadda, yadda."
You said, "Lots of women in the world don't demand reciprocity from men because it's built into these patriarchial-driven societies for women to cater to men, however the main difference between those cultures/societies and that of AAs is that those cultures have an amount of reciprocity (though not nearly enough) built in for the women, whereas AA culture lacks that built-in piece totally and completely now."
This is what I mean by "raised to be foolish." However, the price tag for a woman submitting to patriarchy is now MUCH, MUCH higher in the AA culture. There is NO reciprocity built-in to AA culture anymore.
You said, "Cosigning that it's very dangerous for third parties to get involved in DV disputes. There was a case in PA a few months ago where a Hispanic man killed his sister-in-law for her interference in his ongoing beatings of his wife (the dead woman's sister). Anyway, this was also gruesome because he carried the dead woman's body around for several days in the trunk of his car.
He's in prison now, but his wife (who allowed him to beat her) is still alive and probably with another man by now while her sister is in the ground."
{very long sigh} The odds are that the former wife has hooked up with ANOTHER abusive man. Meanwhile, the Good Samaritan sister is dead and buried.
You said, "Very young girls need empowerment training badly because later on, these issues are so firmly rooted in these women until they become like victims waiting for their accident."
I agree 1,000%! Just look at all the women who makes excuses for abusive men. It's crazy.
Peace, blessings and solidarity.
I don't have personal evidence and "testimony" that supports ALL of what you've said. However, I can offer an "amen" re: some of what you've said. (Sorry for all of the Christian references!)
I can't offer "all" because either my sensibilities, her lassitude/victimhood, and/or The Universe protected me from the "in house" offer of assistance. But many dollars and, perhaps, one BFF lighter? Let me just say this: good deeds in support of these "victims" often shall be punished! If you choose to help? Don't look for gratitude (for long).
During the year of leaving her husband (which was only after years of emotional abuse and open adultery and bullying and precipitated when he choked her youngest son who tried to protect the "victim" after hubby knocked her to the floor), I helped. How? I supplemented the household income for months (she moved in with her eldest son who had roommates and a menial job; I paid him several thousands to absorb the costs of his mother and two brothers), paid the retainer to a lawyer friend to handle the divorce (one thousand), proffered my lawyer friend several new clients to offset the, ultimately, pro bono divorce proceedings (as the "victim" didn't contribute one dollar), paid the first/last/security deposit to relocate the "victim" and her three sons (nearly $2,000), and provided a week of free summer New England lodging and fun activities (they were stressed; I wanted them to feel FREE in their new life).
Recently, I decided that I wouldn't disrupt my life to be the witness at her divorce hearing (the manifestation of wisdom) and suggested that she ask one of her siblings to do it. Said "victim" asked "WHY CAN'T YOU DO IT?!!" Said "victim" also indicated that it's harder without me. No %$#!, Sherlock. I reminded her that the "hard" partS had occurred all along and UP to this point; sitting on the stand in a family court room for 15 minutes is easy.
During this entire time, understand that the "victim" and said sons managed to buy me ONE grocery store flower arrangement, delivered LATE (weeks) after my birthday. They also failed to manage ONE GIFT or ONE CARD for me under the Christmas tree, at the Kwanzaa table, or for Valentine's Day. I visited them Thanksgiving, Christmas, and New Year. She/they couldn't even manage to provide me with a decent plate of food or proper (meaning any) hosting/engagment. I'm not a material person. I do appreciate appreciation. My therapist put it best (albeit modestly): they were inconsiderate. No %$#!, Sherlock.
Slowly, but surely, I've gotten wiser. Mind you, said "victim" didn't attend my mother's funeral. My.Mother's.Funeral. She blamed her husband for blocking her capacity to leave the house. Okay. And yet??!
Suffice it (and much as I also hate to submit) to say? "Victims" are manipulators and remain viable with enablers. As a good faith friend, I also became an enabler and, ultimately, a true victim. But, because I don't covet or value a victim mentality? I shall move on. Poorer. But, wiser.
Greetings, Anonymous!
I don't mind the Christian references at all. LOL! Participants from all or no faiths are welcome here!
{shaking my head at your experience} I praise God that you got through all of that with your life! Playing Good Samaritan with battered women can be EXTREMELY dangerous.
You said, "Let me just say this: good deeds in support of these "victims" often shall be punished! If you choose to help? Don't look for gratitude (for long)."
From what I've seen, this is how it works most of the time. We must make every effort to be wise with our help.
You said, "Suffice it (and much as I also hate to submit) to say? "Victims" are manipulators and remain viable with enablers."
I agree. This is another unflattering truth about many of these situations. I've watched many women use allegations of DV (as well as sexual abuse of the children) as "cards" to play during divorce and child support proceedings.
I've also watched many genuinely battered and abused women (some of whom were my clients) play games with the Orders of Protection that they get.
They call the police to enforce the Order, and have the abusive man arrested, when they're angry with the abusive man for a reason other than the abuse (cheating, etc.). And then they invite the abusive man back into their home (in violation of the protective order) when they're feeling lovey-dovey again.
Seeing all of this at work has made me extremely leery of trying to help such women. Truth be told, they have hardened my heart about this issue.
Peace, blessings and solidarity.
Greetings Khadija! {waves}
This domestic violence issue is ...again....on everyone's radar because a black female celebrity's hidden violent relationship spilled into the open...
I agree with you that people SHOULD NOT rush in to save the person being battered. That battered woman must make a decision about the boundaries that she will make. Often, she can not identify those boundaries until she has had counseling.
This is the problem I notice with those who try to help...they expect a person who is NOT emotionally in a healthy place to make sane and rational decisions about self-preservation. It's unrealistic.
If that person who is being battered is unwilling to go into therapy immediately and recognize that the situation will not change until she is whole, then there can be no assistance offered to her because she will only create more dysfunction in any place that is offered to her as a refuge. You are exactly right.
Many battered women leave one batterer only to wind up in a relationship with another one and another one.
Peace, blessings and DUNAMIS!
Lisa
Thank you for this post! I came to this conclusion a few years ago, but its very un-PC to speak it aloud. I would not risk my life or health by interfering in a DV situation. Yes, I will call the cops, and if a woman is serious about leaving her abuser, I will even provide shelter depending on how close I am to the woman.
My niece had a friend who lived next door to us several years ago. The friend lived with her mother, and her mother’s boyfriend. One summer day we had a cook out in the back yard when we heard screaming and yelling. The woman was being beaten by her boyfriend, and actually began screaming for my 8-year-old niece to help her! She was actually screaming my niece’s name and telling her to come and help her!! My niece wanted to go upstairs, but my mother stopped her. Instead we called the cops. By the time the cops got there, it was over. We directed the cops to the right door, and when they knocked, she opened the door and told them that he had left. The cops told her they had to come in and talk to her, but I guess the boyfriend hid while she talked to them. Do you know this woman didn’t speak to us for about a month after this incident! Apparently, she didn’t want the cops called. She just wanted someone to come and help her. As far as I was concerned, the cops were help! The boyfriend never spoke to us again, which was fine by me. My niece was very confused by the whole thing, and I was actually mad myself, so her not speaking worked for me. I couldn’t help but wonder what would have happened if my niece had been visiting her daughter or if she had been in the back yard by herself. She probably would have gone up there to try to help. And what about my niece’s friend? God only knows what she was seeing living there. After that incident I forbade my niece from ever going to their house again.
In these situations, you are not only up against the abuser, you are also up against the abused. How many times have the cops put cuffs on an abuser only to have the victim scream to leave him alone. I can't save a woman from herself.
Greetings, Lisa!
You said, "This is the problem I notice with those who try to help...they expect a person who is NOT emotionally in a healthy place to make sane and rational decisions about self-preservation. It's unrealistic."
Exactly! I've observed that many battered women are more interested in preserving the relationship than their own lives. If they don't care about their own lives, and that of their children, then they really DON'T care about any Good Samaritan's safety!
You said, "If that person who is being battered is unwilling to go into therapy immediately and recognize that the situation will not change until she is whole, then there can be no assistance offered to her because she will only create more dysfunction in any place that is offered to her as a refuge."
Yes. The safest thing for any layperson to do is to refer domestic violence victims to the proper authorities and social service agencies. And keep your distance from all of that!
You said, "Many battered women leave one batterer only to wind up in a relationship with another one and another one."
I've noticed a similar pattern with clients who have allowed their boyfriends to sexually molest their children. They typically hook up with a series of men who are pedophiles.
The pedophiles do a similar "screening" and "interview" process to find women with children who will NOT protect their children from molestation. Yet another unflattering truth is that there's a fairly large pool of women who are more invested into holding onto a relationship than their own children's safety.
___________________
Greetings, Anonymous!
You said, "Thank you for this post! I came to this conclusion a few years ago, but its very un-PC to speak it aloud. I would not risk my life or health by interfering in a DV situation. Yes, I will call the cops, and if a woman is serious about leaving her abuser, I will even provide shelter depending on how close I am to the woman."
You're welcome! And no, it's not PC to say this stuff out loud. But I have a thing about "the truth, the WHOLE truth." LOL! And I've seen a lot of would-be Good Samaritans get burned while trying to help battered women.
Again, the safest thing for any layperson to do is to refer domestic violence victims to the proper authorities and social service agencies. And STAY AWAY from that situation.
You said, "In these situations, you are not only up against the abuser, you are also up against the abused. How many times have the cops put cuffs on an abuser only to have the victim scream to leave him alone. I can't save a woman from herself."
I've listened to MANY police officers describe how a battered woman attacked the police officers who were trying to arrest her abuser! This is part of why the police don't like responding to these sorts of 911 calls. It puts them in physical danger on behalf of a victim who may or may not join their abuser in fighting them.
Another part of why the police don't like to respond to these calls is because a fair number of officers are batterers themselves.
I praise God that your niece didn't get caught up in that mess! {shaking my head}
Peace, blessings and solidarity.
BTW Lisa, I can't get to your site. It pops up for a split-sec but is quickly replaced by an error message.
You said, "The pedophiles do a similar "screening" and "interview" process to find women with children who will NOT protect their children from molestation. Yet another unflattering truth is that there's a fairly large pool of women who are more invested into holding onto a relationship than their own children's safety."
I'll be honest, whenever you mention something like this, I cringe. It is so sickening to read some of these details although I've already dealt with many of these issues in therapy.
And it's true, people should only help victims of domestic violence from a distance.
As a child, I witnessed my mother turn on people who tried to intervene when she was getting beat on.
As an adult, I was told by my brothers that once she regained custody of them, that she would turn on them whenever they tried to stop the fighting between her and her husband.
They eventually just learned to tune it out, by going into their bedrooms and turning on some music.
Greetings, DeStouet!
Yes, the details ARE sickening. I praise God for those children who have survived being exposed to this type of insanity, such as yourself.
The WHOLE truth needs to be told about how some of these battered women behave. For the safety of their children. For the safety of well-meaning Good Samaritans who want to be helpful.
This is a matter of public safety.
But, as you originally noted, some of the details. Are. Sickening.
Over the years, I've had to hand off a few cases to colleagues. This was because I realized that I was spending some of my in-court time daydreaming about putting a bullet in certain clients' heads. As you might imagine, these daydreams would interfere with preparing for those particular clients' cases.
[Another colleague sometimes finds himself counting all the ways he could sneak a gun into the client interview room and blast certain clients.]
Peace, blessings and solidarity.
Hi again Khadija! {waves}
Thank you for mentioning that batterers DO have a selection process for choosing who will tolerate their sickness.
Many women just think they keep winding up with these men. They don't see that they are being CHOSEN by these sickos.
This is what I have encountered as a rape crisis responder. Rapists CHOOSE their targets. They look at many factors and they are calculating whether they will be successful. Women who have been raped should not blame themselves for what happened. Still, they must understand that most rapists do not just strike randomly at any woman. There is a method to their insanity.
The same holds true for batterers.
Peace, blessings and DUNAMIS!
Lisa
Hello there, Lisa!
{excited waving}
You said,"Thank you for mentioning that batterers DO have a selection process for choosing who will tolerate their sickness.
Many women just think they keep winding up with these men. They don't see that they are being CHOSEN by these sickos."
Let me be blunt:
Everybody needs to finally get it through their heads that ALL predators have a selection process! And you don't want to fit into the profile that says "Easy Prey."
There are a handful of absolute psychos that will do what they do regardless of the signals being sent by potential prey. But this is NOT at all the norm.
Even the "Officially Crazy For Real" clients that I've had are NOT crazy enough to mess with even-scarier predators! I can count on the fingers of ONE hand the number of clients I've had over the years who would do things regardless of who was around, or who they did it too.
Even otherwise-delusional schizophrenics try to exercise the rudiments of self-preservation.
Predators are predators, and NOT warriors. Predators are NOT looking for prey that's going to put up a serious fight for long. Or, God forbid, do something to hurt THEM in the process. Predators are looking for what's easy; and what's fairly predictable prey. Predators are also always looking for an "edge," and as many advantages over potential prey as possible.
For just one example, I cringe (inside) everytime I see a woman walking around with headphones on. Even if the music is turned off, that woman is giving predators the signal that she can't hear who or what's coming up behind her. THIS is NOT a good look.
I cringe (inside) everytime I see a woman walking around with her head down staring at the ground so she can't even see who's around her. Or if they're approaching her. Or how close they are before they're right up on her.
I cringe because I know that if I notice this, so do any predators in the immediate area.
None of what I'm saying is about blaming victims. It's about everyone learning to give off as many signals as possible that say "TROUBLE" to any predator that might be watching you. And any predator who might be "interviewing" you during the dating process.
Peace, blessings and solidarity.
Salaam Khadija,
Thank you for speaking out about this! When ever Muslims generally do speak out about DV it’s done in an “academic” or cut and paste manner--I personally think that’s deliberate because many don’t truly care!
Evia said: “This means that you must always be as flawless as possible in your appearance, health, fitness, emotions, education, job skills, financial state, etc. I've never had to take nonsense from folks or only for a minute because I've made myself flawless enough to be able to close the door on them if they didn't honor my requests.”
SS: What I’ve observed in the MC ( Muslim community) is many women who are abused don’t want to leave because it would require them to work a.k.a. be self sufficient so they stay--even those with graduate degrees. Their reasoning is that it’s better to have a roof over their head and get beat up versus staying in a shelter with all the uncertainty that brings--not realizing their situation is already uncertain… I’ve also heard stories of women who re-married while in DV shelter to another abuser…
Evia said: “Lots of women in the world don't demand reciprocity from men because it's built into these patriarchal-driven societies for women to cater to men, however the main difference between those cultures/societies and that of AAs is that those cultures have an amount of reciprocity (though not nearly enough) built in for the women, whereas AA culture lacks that built-in piece totally and completely now.”
SS: Ever heard of Muhammad Asad? Check out his book “Islam at the Crossroads.” According to this European Jewish convert, Islam was in a state of decay in the 17th century--can you imagine the crisis now? Evia, what your talking about NO LONGER exist for the world Muslim community either. Truth to be told, some of the same dysfunctions present in the AA community/population are also present in the IMM community/population. While the degree or severity may vary its not GREAT. There was a reason Islam spread. And thrived. And the reason was justice.
What I know for sure is that:
1) I will NEVER encourage a Muslimah to seek help from the Islamic clergy nor any Islamic groups or organizations. Muslim women in their right mind need to spread the word: if you need help go to your county’s city’s, town’s department of family or social services.
2) There is a local masjid here in Northern Virginia that has some type of sharia meditation court in which agreements are binding after that. I don’t know how or why the local court system allowed that to happen. What I know for sure is that the majority of time Islam is taught in such a manner that “men’s rights” CANCEL out women’s rights. I don’t why on earth an American convert or born American Muslim would give up FREEDOM for some male dominated communities interpretation of the deen.
3) I will NEVER encourage Muslim children or teenagers to seek help from the Islamic clergy nor any Islamic groups or organizations. Muslim women in their right mind need to spread the word: if you need help go to your county’s city’s, town’s department of family or social services.
4) The next public meeting in which non-profits are asked to join in helping out “at risk” families, I’m going to speak up and start running my mouth about my experiences in the local Muslim community.
While it’s nice that Imam Magid has written an open letter to American Imams asking them to take all claims of DV or CA seriously, it’s not going to matter if you are dealing with both men and women who believe that not only has Allah ordained it but that IT ISN’T a problem or that IT IS justifiable. I hate to be negative or the bearer of bad news but his words are going to fall on deaf ears--literally, reminds me of the ayah in the Qur’an “deaf, dumb, and blind.”
I DO believe in scripture. I DO believe in miracles. I DO believe in prophecies. I believe that the DEGREE and RATE of DV in the MC is a plague. I believe it’s a warning that the MC isn’t taking seriously. The men are destroying our religion. Not the: Jews, Christians, Kafirs, or the long list of “it’s all their fault. The scholars who are not hard enough on their fellow clergy are destroying the chance of our religion flourishing and being passed on successfully to the next generation.
And on a final note. This is ONE of the MAJOR reasons my DH and I ended up isolated. My husband would befriend a brother, and than find out he was abusing his wife or committing adultery. So he would end the relationship. This is also ONE of the MAJOR reasons I REFUSE to place my child in a Muslim school--especially one owned by IMM’s.
As regards to sexual abuse of children I think we all have to understand the dynamics of the situation. I have rarely had a client whose child was abused who herself was not a victim of abuse. We didn't call it 'the gift that keeps on giving' for nothing. These women who don't protect their children, or continually choose abusive men do so for a reason. It's what they've been conditioned to do. Understand this if you never understand anything I've ever said: A woman who has not been protected, cannot protect. I know it sounds counter-intuitive. We think, "Surely a woman who has known abuse herself would be fanatical about protecting her children." Sadly, this is often not the case. The human mind can sometimes work against us, especially if it's programmed to do so. It is fairly easy to condition someone toe seek that which is familiar, even if it is dysfunctional, even detrimental.
This is why I'm so fanatical about the fact that women who've been sexually abused must get help, they must have therapy. Otherwise there's every likelihood that they will choose an abusive partner, over and over again.
Also, understand that I've rarely met a rape victim who was not also a victim of sexual abuse. Again, this is not victim blaming, but we have to look at the victimology. Victims of sexual abuse typically have poor boundaries. This is not their fault, they've been conditioned to believe that they have no rights of autonomy, not even over their own bodies. They ignore signals and intuition because they don't trust their own instincts, thus leaving them open to attack by predators.
Black women are more likely to be victimized than any other group, you must seek counseling so that you can break the cycle of abuse.
I also forgot to mention that I believe that when you and your dh are having problems the first thing a woman should do is get on reliable birth control and stop having children.
I've been cussed out so bad... lol from other Muslims especially online for saying this.
All I can say is that as a survivor myself, I learned a LOOOOOOOOOOONG time ago NO ONE is coming to SAVE me or siblings. It was up to us in our youth to figure out what to do.
Salaam
Wa Alaikum As Salaam, SisterSeeeking/Miriam!
You said, "Thank you for speaking out about this! When ever Muslims generally do speak out about DV it’s done in an “academic” or cut and paste manner--I personally think that’s deliberate because many don’t truly care!"
Many don't care because they are enabling DV themselves. I've said this before, let me repeat it here:
Many BW accept Islam in order to please a Muslim man. This sets them up for abuse because they came to the deen to please a man and NOT God. This sets them up for abuse because they depend on the man for all of their religious guidance. For these women, the religion becomes whatever the man says it is.
Many BM who are wanna-be batterers and harem-operators come to Islam because Ike Turner Imams offer them fake religious approval for these behaviors.
This is often the sort of back-story for the insane commenters in discussions like the one that I linked to in the post.
You said, "What I’ve observed in the MC ( Muslim community) is many women who are abused don’t want to leave because it would require them to work a.k.a. be self sufficient so they stay--even those with graduate degrees."
Thank you for telling the WHOLE TRUTH about the motives that go into many of these situations.
You said, "I’ve also heard stories of women who re-married while in DV shelter to another abuser…"
Lord have mercy.
You said, "There was a reason Islam spread. And thrived. And the reason was justice."
Exactly! And the total LACK of justice is the reason why most AA Muslims are NOT able to successfully transmit the deen to their children.
Many, if not most, 2nd generation AA Muslims FLEE from the madness and confusion that AA Muslims have created in their faith communities. I think of all the AAs who were raised Muslim as children and left the deen like actor Malik Yoba (from "New York Undercover").
*Note to curious new readers: I talked about the underlying reasons for what went wrong among AA (Sunni) Muslims in a post entitled Demographics is Destiny. You can find it by searching for posts tagged "Islam." [There's a search panel above the blog masthead.]
You said, "I will NEVER encourage a Muslimah to seek help from the Islamic clergy nor any Islamic groups or organizations. Muslim women in their right mind need to spread the word: if you need help go to your county’s city’s, town’s department of family or social services."
WORD! The Islamic clergy and groups will generally: Get. Women. Killed.
You said, "The men are destroying our religion."
The men PLUS the women who enable them to do so.
_________________
Greetings, Roslyn!
You said, "As regards to sexual abuse of children I think we all have to understand the dynamics of the situation. I have rarely had a client whose child was abused who herself was not a victim of abuse. We didn't call it 'the gift that keeps on giving' for nothing. These women who don't protect their children, or continually choose abusive men do so for a reason. It's what they've been conditioned to do. Understand this if you never understand anything I've ever said: A woman who has not been protected, cannot protect."
True that! My point is that this is a public safety issue. And that, whatever the origin of their DV- and sexual abuse-enabling behaviors, these women are ALSO a part of the public safety problem. It doesn't matter that it's ultimately not these women's "fault." They're still a threat to their children's safety AND to public safety due to their enabling behaviors.
You said, "This is why I'm so fanatical about the fact that women who've been sexually abused must get help, they must have therapy. Otherwise there's every likelihood that they will choose an abusive partner, over and over again."
Therapy only has a chance of working if the patient is willing recognize that THEY need to make some changes in their thinking. What I see with the clients is that they prefer to believe that they've had a running streak of bad luck, etc. They generally REFUSE to consider that maybe there's something going on with them that is helping to create these bad situations.
As you said, "The human mind can sometimes work against us, especially if it's programmed to do so. It is fairly easy to condition someone toe seek that which is familiar, even if it is dysfunctional, even detrimental."
What I've observed is that many of the clients choose to believe that the way they're living is normal. They choose to believe that those who are suggesting other ways of life are simply "jealous," "haters," or have some other negative, ulterior motive.
Peace, blessings and solidarity.
Great discussion, Khadija! There is always an underbelly side to every issue. Battered women's collusion with their enemy is a very real problem.
On the subject of being targeted by rapists, please know there are some very dangerous men out there who WILL go after a random woman, it depends on her situation. ALL females can be potential prey if they are traveling alone or in a similar vulnerable situation. Women have to be prepared for any situation. You can raise your head tall, be aware of your surroundings, and it still is not an insurance policy of being fully protected. There are some predators out there who are not afraid of ANY woman. And just being female alone makes you potential prey in their eyes. I agree with you Khadija that there are lot of punks who will pick on weaker people and avoid others, but I think the women here need to realize there are some vicious, evil people who will not discriminate. I have seen some of their kind and they are truly frightening.
I’m sure every woman on this blog has been in a potentially vulnerable situation at one point in her life. You may have gotten in an elevator during normal business hours, but alone with a shady character. You are potential prey because you’re alone in an enclosed space. What will you do if someone puts you in a choke hold, or pulls out a weapon? Even waking up to see a stranger looming over your bed? Do you know how to act once being aware is not enough?
Gavin De Becker's Gift of Fear is required reading for everyone. He gives excellent analysis of the perils women in general face at the hands of men. Every situation is not the same. Some women who have survived potential horrendous attacks did so by negotiating with their attacker and talking to them. It’s not always about physical self-defense. There will be some in this world who will try to compromise you. Listen to your instincts! Most of the time we shut that inner voice that something is not right, but because too many women don't want to come off as mean or a man-hater, they put that natural instinct of self-preservation into dormancy in order not to offend. This society, and particularly in the segregated AA culture, conditions females young and old to let their guard down with men, and make themselves "open" to them at their own peril.
Case in point, my friend did business with this wanna be plumber. She wanted to save on money, and decided to do business with the legitimate plumber’s assistant under the table. He said would not charge her as much as the company his boss works for. She didn’t know him; he didn’t have any references from people who could verify he was a professional. He did some half-assed work in her house and ended up charging her more than the plumbing company’s estimate. He wanted cash right then and there. She said she would give him a money order. He said he didn’t want her mailing stuff to his house because a lot of people live there, someone may intercept his mail. She managed for him to agree to the money order. Now he’s harassing her, his is accusing her of being unprofessional. Mind you, he’s calling at 11pm with this nonsense on her cell phone. She told him to leave her alone. He just recently called and left a message about her joining him in a job where she could make an easy $100. She wants to report him to the police but also doesn’t want to do that to a brotha. SMH! This is a black woman homeowner who’s educated with a master degree from an Ivy League school. This cuts across class.
Why are black women so concerned about random black men who are threatening them? I truly don’t understand it. It’s a mental disease.
I'll use two examples from movies that I recall triggered a reaction.
1. Things We Lost In the Fire
The husband was killed by a perp when he intervened on him beating his wife on the street
2. Seven Pounds
The segment where the battered woman was "rescued" after protesting there wasn't a problem and given the protagonist's house. I thought it was a nice gesture but it rang hallow to me because we have no way of knowing the woman actually changed and stayed away from abusive men.
On a personal note I can attest that a parent with unresolved abuse or trauma is ill-equipped to make wise choices or protect their children. For myself I admit I may have waited too long to mate and reproduce but my main concern was always about financial resources and having the ideal scenario (no poor choices and being stuck with a jerk and no baby momma scenarios).
Since I couldn't always trust my own judgement and was engaging in what I now recognize to be uneven emotional contracts I thought it best to hold off than make an irrevocable decision. I have no way of knowing whether this was the best choice but it was appropriate for that time.
Greetings, Jazine!
Thank you for your kind words about the post discussion. I truly appreciate it. You said, "There is always an underbelly side to every issue."
Yep. This underbelly is what I mean by the "reality check" aspects to situations.
You said, "Gavin De Becker's Gift of Fear is required reading for everyone."
YES!YES!YES! DeBecker's book is truly a Godsend. I would also strongly recommend "Eyes Wide Open: Bodyguard Strategies for Self-Protection" by Kristie Kilgore.
As you noted, situational awareness is only the BEGINNING of self-preservation. There are ALWAYS moments and places of heightened vulnerability. Part of protecting ourselves is to think through some things.
One thing that Kilgore points out is to be aware of what she calls "Fatal Funnels." Fatal funnels are places that have only one way in and out. Such as the elevator example you mentioned. Other examples are the dead end of a hallway and office cubicles. If the predator blocks the entrance/exit then you are trapped.
The Kilgore book had this to say about elevators:
"You can take steps to regain some control of variables in elevators. If you are on an elevator when the door opens, you can subtly hold the door open as someone steps in.
If the individual has a 'bad feel,' this allows you the opportunity to step off discreetly, as though you were waiting for the person to get on first before leaving.
Conversely, if the doors open and you are waiting to get one, you have the freedom to wait for another elevator. The stranger does not necessarily know you were the one who pushed the button; you could be waiting for an elevator going the other direction.
Dismiss the stranger's perception of you as irrelevant." Eyes Wide Open, pg. 122-123 [emphasis added].
The last part is critical, and ties into what you mentioned about BW being taught to worry about looking "mean" or "rude." Circumstances have reached the point where every woman needs to forget "the dumb s***" and listen to her own instincts for self-preservation!
Peace, blessings and solidarity.
Greetings, Faith!
Where there is life, there is hope. Also, you made the best decisions you could with the information you had. And please keep in mind that you've done MUCH better than many others.
I've been shocked recently everytime I remember that I actually know people who are DEAD because of errors in judgment.
In an earlier post, I mentioned the colleague who initially chose to use prayer and herbs instead of modern surgery to deal with a cancerous lump in her breast. She is dead. After MUCH unnecessary suffering.
One of my former courtroom partners is dead because of issues related to his drug addiction.
There are some other Black colleagues who, truth be told, are well on their way to being dead due to a variety of issues.
Including a couple of BF attorneys that some coworkers were taking bets on how much longer until their no-working-Negro, domestically-violent husbands were going to finally get around to killing them.
I've previously mentioned how one of these women was beat down in the court building parking lot one morning right before work. In front of her clients. In front of her coworkers. In front of the White prosecutors and sheriffs who were clucking about it for the rest of the week. In front of everybody who was in the parking lot at that moment.
I had another BF coworker whose (openly cheating) husband had taken out a huge life insurance policy on her. Then, mysteriously, "somebody" was repeatedly tampering with her car's tires in such a way that could cause a blowout during her daily highway commute. So said the investigators that work for my firm who examined the tires.
This particular woman was initially very angry with everyone who told her to cancel that policy; and get away from her husband. She accused them all of being jealous haters.
The reality is that a LOT of folks have already been taken out as a result of their bad decisions. I praise God that you're not among this number.
Peace, blessings and solidarity.
Khadija,
I have been lurking for the last couple of posts. I felt compelled to speak out on this issue because I grew up in an abusive environment. As you and others may or may not know, my father physically, psychologically, and emotionally abused my mother, sister, and I all our lives. He now abuses my brother as well. I am always afraid that my brother will grow up to be an abuser. I pray that he doesn't, that he becomes a better man than my father is. My mother and father have been married for 34 years. My mother informed him recently that when my brother graduates from high school next year, she is going to divorce him. I'm afraid that he is going to go crazy and kill her or damage her so severely that her life will never be the same (i.e. Yvette Cade). I told her that I am willing to do whatever I can to help her. I desperately want for her to finally be happy and live the life that she deserves to live.
I understand why you say that it is dangerous to help victims of DV. It is emotionally harmfull as well. When you get involved in such a delicate situation, it can be emotionally draining. Getting angry at the abuser only to feel silly or betrayed a week later when the victim is sitting on the abuser's lap smiling as if nothing ever happened. Or spending your precious time listening to the victim cry and complain about the abuse only to be criticized for badmouthing the abuser once they "make up". I think that what Lisa said about the need for therapy for victims of abuse is absolutely necessary in order not to be victimized continuously. I have had therapy and plan to continue the therapy one day.
Thanks for this informative and insightful post. Thanks for saying what others feel but are afraid to say.
Peace and solidarity,
Tasha
Greetings, Tasha!
I praise God that you made it through the home environment that you described. [And yes, I remember this from when you mentioned it on your blog.] I will keep you and your loved ones in my prayers.
You said, "Thanks for this informative and insightful post. Thanks for saying what others feel but are afraid to say."
You're welcome! And you know that I have a big mouth, and an often-shrill voice! LOL! We need to purify our collective of all of these problems. The first step is to speak the WHOLE truth about every component that goes into creating (and maintaining) these problems.
Peace, blessings and solidarity.
Sister Seeking/Miriam/MaryAnn said...
While it’s nice that Imam Magid has written an open letter to American Imams asking them to take all claims of DV or CA seriously, it’s not going to matter if you are dealing with both men and women who believe that not only has Allah ordained it but that IT ISN’T a problem or that IT IS justifiable. I hate to be negative or the bearer of bad news but his words are going to fall on deaf ears--literally, reminds me of the ayah in the Qur’an “deaf, dumb, and blind.”
My emphasis. The open letter Sister Seeking refers to is quoted entire in the post RESPONDING TO THE KILLING OF AASIYA HASSAN: AN OPEN LETTER TO THE LEADERS OF AMERICAN MUSLIM COMMUNITIES by Margari Aziza Hill on her blog: The Writer Formally Known as "Just Another Angry Black Muslim Woman?"
Imam Mohamed Hagmagid Ali says all the right things, clearly, forcefully, and specifically. I don't know how it could be improved except maybe more anger. How much effect might this call to action have on the MC? What might happen to this imam's influence in the MC?
Wishing you all progress.
Greetings, Aabaakawad!
Yes, Imam Magid is saying the right things. The problem is that he's saying the right things to an audience that has a LARGE population of woman-hating lunatics. For an example, just look at what the nuts are saying in response to the beheading in the blog discussion that I linked to in the body of this post.
In terms of AA Sunni ("Orthodox") Muslims, this is part of what I had to say in the 1/09 post "Demographics is Destiny: What Went Wrong with Sunni ("Orthodox") Black Muslims":
". . . Men's concerns are the currency that most Muslims use. There's no point to be served by me pointing out women's concerns, because these are generally men who explicitly don't care about women. Period. The possibility of religiously-approved misogyny is what attracts many BM to Islam in the first place. Islam (as practiced) is often the last refuge of wanna-be batterers and wanna-be harem-operators.
From what I hear and read, this is getting worse with the increasing prevalence of Black Muslim "Ike Turner" imams. This is partially the result of African-American Muslims adopting Arab cultural practices such as extreme misogyny. Many of us mistake Arab and/or Pakistani tribal culture with Islam itself."
My feeling is that a lot of folks (men AND women) in various mosques don't care about what happened to this woman. All they care about is the negative public relations fallout.
I have the feeling that these sorts of correct statements are nothing but lip service to be said for public consumption ONLY for many of these imams. I could be wrong about this. I hope I am; but I doubt it.
Peace, blessings and solidarity.
@Aabaakawad
"Imam Mohamed Hagmagid Ali says all the right things, clearly, forcefully, and specifically. I don't know how it could be improved except maybe more anger. How much effect might this call to action have on the MC? What might happen to this imam's influence in the MC?"
1. The issue is NOT with Imam Magid. The issue is NOT with the open letter he wrote. The issue is with the MC it's self--specifically Muslim men, and WOMEN who are: PREDATORS, ENABLERS, and BYSTANDERS. No one is claiming he did anything wrong.
Concerning this Imam's influence: people have power because other people gave them power. I can't say that Imam Magid has a great deal of influence. I do see him involved with the county I work for. They also call him when Child protective services is about to remove children from an IMM family. I don't know how much he is involved with the BAM's.
At this moment in time: NO ONE Islamic scholar has ANY power, authority, or crediability with MY FAMILY.
Back to the issue:
Like other groups of people, and like other religous communities, predators have *infiltrated* command positions in the MC peroid. I'm not in denial about that. I'm not one of those Muslims who believes Muslims are immune from dysfunction. Some IMM leaders are BIG TIME enablers: case and point: Khalid Yasin. Check out a Singular Voice if you want to see how embarassing the situation has become.
___________________________________
@Khadija,
I want to respond to a comment you made but let me share something personal here:
One day, about two years after I became Muslim, I was waiting for my ride so I was senting in front of the masjid on this bench between the school's ( both Musullah and full time school) office and the sulk. The school was empty. I'm talking ghost town or so I thought. I heard two men walking down the hallway and talking. I heard them bragging about how many teenager girls were in their own exact words {YUM and YUMMY} They went on and on about how they loved some of their students. Young and dumb--I start hypervenitalating and sweating drops of rain man! I was in a complete state of shock. They turned the corner, and looked up and saw me. They KNEW I heard every thing they said. These to BA men were teachers who taught at this Muslim school... They gave me a stare... that to this day... I can only describe as MURDEROUS. Praise be to Allah, my ride showed up, and I RAN not walked RAN THE HELL UP out of that place. I tried to tell others but was accused of "slander" "backbiting" I was basically shunned. So I stopped caring, and walked away from THAT community--not realizing its so darn widespread.
___________________________________
Khadija said:
Many BW accept Islam in order to please a Muslim man. This sets them up for abuse because they came to the deen to please a man and NOT God. This sets them up for abuse because they depend on the man for all of their religious guidance. For these women, the religion becomes whatever the man says it is.
SS: Khadija, I didn't realize this until I started blogging. I remember when Abdur-Rahman Muhammad first came out and wrote his famous series: Why black American Muslims don't stand for justice, I stated upfront that I converted becuase I believed in the creed and that was it. In the beginning NO ONE believed me. I have said this over and over that the reason some one converts is the best indicator of how each segment of the convert community will turn out.
Anyways: truth stands clear from falsehood.
By the way, Maragari has an AWESOME blog, and I encourage people to check it out. I would have commented on this issue there but when I clicked on one of the links and saw an Imam there making a comment about how DV affects men, I decided not to. There is a time and place for everything. When some one is beheaded that is not the time to drag in another issue that affects another population. Thats my opinion. And I remain firm and will not be moved. The issue here is WOMEN and *CHILDREN*NOT men.
Salaam
P.S. I can NOT wait until the next public meeting...
They're still a threat to their children's safety AND to public safety due to their enabling behaviors.
Indubitably. My comments were directed more towards those who have been abused. I agree that it is best to direct them to trained professionals than try to intervene yourself. I wasn't trying to excuse their behavior, just trying to get them to understand why therapy is so important.
Hello there, SisterSeeking/Miriam!
You said, "P.S. I can NOT wait until the next public meeting..."
I'm sure it'll be memorable. LOL!
__________________
Hello there, Roslyn!
You said, "My comments were directed more towards those who have been abused. I agree that it is best to direct them to trained professionals than try to intervene yourself. I wasn't trying to excuse their behavior, just trying to get them to understand why therapy is so important."
Oh no...I didn't take it as trying to excuse their behavior. I know that YOU know the "real deal" about such situations because of your work experiences.
My concern is that the message has never really gotten out that many of these women are a menace to their children's safety, AND to public safety, because of their enabling behaviors. Even though they are victims, they are still a menace.
Peace, blessings and solidarity.
I think it's unfortunate that you're having to direct women away from their spiritual leaders in times of crisis. I think it's natural for many women to seek out their pastor in these situations, and it's unfortunate that no help is forthcoming to them. In the past I've been able to work with some pastors in DV and CA situations. A lot of seminaries these days require their pastors to have training in counseling and some even have advanced degrees in the field.
Of course, you have to carefully screen these people because many churches are still full of the misogynist/chauvinist leaders as well. It's always iffy, of course. I think I remember a rape case where T.D. Jakes and Deion Saunders counseled a victim against reporting her rape by another pastor.
As I've said before, I'm not particularly religious myself, primarily because of the appalling sexism I witnessed in the Baptist church as a child. I all but chewed off a limb to escape that place years ago. We attend an Episcopal church (primarily because my dh's father was a priest), and it seems very comfortable to me. Or at least, more open about the role of women. It's not without controversy though, as I'm sure you've all heard.
Hello All,
I saw this story on the news and it is very shocking. I also went and read the comments posted and I am always amazed at how a woman can have such empathy for a murderer.
"If an individual or a group doesn't demand reciprocity in their dealings with others from- the-very-beginning-of-the- interaction.......They will actually think you're attacking them when you make a request."
I am dealing with this now and it is blowing my mind. Recently I threw down a boundary concerning a trigger with a long term friend who has been supportive in the past so I didn't think this would be a big deal. Also she has placed boundaries around this same trigger with others and has expressed her upset when others don't respect it.
I thought it would be noted and we would move on - as I have always done for her when she puts down boundaries around triggers with me.
Instead she went into a tearful tirade about how she was hurt by the boundary and thought she was "special to me" and how I am acting like our history means nothing and how she is all about helping me and I wouldn't give her a chance to explain herself clearly blah blah blah.
I am angry now because this is my first and only time drawing a line in the sand and this is the reaction that I get. I don't want an explanation. I don't see what good it will do and honestly I don't care about explanations. I want her to say I see there is a line in the sand and I won't cross it. Which never happened.
She was all over the place emotionally : crying, screaming, heaving, sobbing and made the whole convo about her which put me in the position of catering to her i.e. calming her down etc and I resented that - as she crossed my boundaries.
I am an intensely passionate person and I feel the way she responded was overkill and excessive.
And she even stooped so low as to take underhanded shots at my religion which incensed me. When I asked her what did that have to do with anything she said nothing. When I asked her what was the point of all this/what kind of resolution was she seeking with all this garbage she said - there is none. Nothing can be done. So now she has withdrawn a emotionally.
So if the ground rules for reciprocity aren't laid out from the beginning is it pretty much impossible to turn things around?
I want to trash the relationship despite the past bc I don't see how I can move forward with someone who won't recognize future boundaries.
But I am concerned about ending it totally as this person has abandonment/rejection issues and I have shared a lot with her - business projects I am starting, books I have written, and well as emotional info and if the verbal shots to my religion are an indicator - I am concerned about sabotage/retaliation.
Re: abuse testing/conditioning
I agree. In hindsight I can see this in my life. I feel that people have tested me not just in the instances that I have been sexually assaulted, but the times I have been ripped off financially, and just generally mistreated.
Usually for me this starts out as inappropriate odd questions. In the past I would get a feeling that something wasn't right, but due to conditioning I would compulsively respond the way I was trained to do.
In the recent past I started developing more awareness during the process.
A present I no longer feel the compulsion to respond and I am aware in the moment, but I also lack the skills to be more diplomatic and graceful in these instances. This is a huge trigger for me and I go into psycho/overprotective/offensive mode when this happens.
I used to think that when people asked questions that they are "making talk"- now looking back I can see that they are gathering info for future use.
RE: DV
Good advice all around. My experience with DV was via my older brother (mom's previous marriage) and all that was said holds true with regards to help and assistance.
I think my brother is a 6'3" obese scum sucking dog. He was a tyrant that made my life hell. While he never raised a hand to me he has often been verbally abusive to myself and my mother throughout our lives. He enjoyed inflicting terror in us and still does to my mother. Oh the stories I could tell about what he has done to my mother.
He stopped doing it to me as a teen the day I made up in my mind that I was ready to die. One day I just snapped and had had enough and decided that one of us was going to die today. Whether he left in in a body bag or me, but it was not going to continue. I am not advocating that anyone do this at all. But my mother wasn't protecting me from him and others made excuses for him so I felt backed into a corner and like I had nothing to lose.
So I made peace with God that day and decided that he was going to get it and the coroners can come and pick up the bodies.
And get it he did. He avoided me for years after that and just recently with me coming home after graduation he refuses to make eye contact with me when speaking, (always with lowered and side eyes), sends messages through my mom when dealing with me, and when he does talk to me you would think he was spitting his words.
When I was a little girl he babysat me once and beat his first wife in front of me until she lost all her front teeth and had a seizure. I was traumatized. I tried to call the police and he took the phone away. She got up washed her face and they all expected me to sit at the dinner table with them - like nothing happened. They said grace and wondered why I wasn't eating.
As a teen I would warn women who talked to him. I would tell them that he was a shiftless scum sucking dog and that he never has had a job and that he beat ever woman he has been with wife or otherwise and he was verbally abusive and you might end up with a disease as he is always trying to get "antibiotics" off my mom. Some listened and some gave responses like:
God told me to be with him
That was his past
I can't give up on a relationship
I can change him
These same women would in turn attack me and my mom after he would batter them.
Anon I am so sorry that you had that experience. That is true ingratitude.
@ Miriam
"I heard two men walking down the hallway and talking. I heard them bragging about how many teenager girls were in their own exact words {YUM and YUMMY} They went on and on about how they loved some of their students. Young and dumb--I start hypervenitalating and sweating drops of rain man! I was in a complete state of shock."
I have a lukewarm Jamaican associate that just confessed to me a few days ago that he has met the love of his life - the woman he is going to marry. He made me promise not to get mad - which I though was odd. He told me that she lives in Atlanta, that she was 1/2 Brazillian, and had a kid - which was interesting because he was so against dealing with women who already had OOW kids.
Then he tells me that she is still in high school and will technically be legal in a year. Mind you that this guy is older than I am - in his 30's and is himself is a junior high school teacher in the state we live in.
I cut that convo off. I wanted to hurl and he was shocked - like I was supposed to say, "Oh yeah, thats normal, I am so happy for you." I should have gotten info to report.
But um yeah - widespread.
Unfortunately I think Miriam may be very right. Some people respect Imam Magid and some don't.
I have heard there were people who got upset that he would not perform a wedding ceremony without a marriage license, after all.
Lawdy, Khadija, I guess this is why so many black folks hide out in magical thinking land. This is some nauseating stuff. LOL!
I tell ya, I have been blessed not to have girl children!! Since I'm not a magical thinker and have always been able to clearly view male predators and those with predator tendencies, I vowed to myself that I would do ANYTHING to protect my children. This is THE reason why I always ONLY spent time with Quality men. I knew that any other kind of man could cause me to have a life where my children would be victimized. I think that ALL AA women need to take that vow and if they're not able to take that vow, DO NOT HAVE CHILDREN!!
The last time I wrote that I was happy I didn't have daughters, I got a few notes criticizing me for saying that, but the FACT is that in a patriarchal world where we have no males protecting
AA women, predator black males are now and will continue to be the GREATEST menace to black girls and women and it's OBVIOUS that MOST bw are just fine with this and are not going to go to war to stop this war on bf. This war against bw is not obvious to many, but it's happening and this is why so many bw are just worn down to a frazzle. Only a relentless war would cause these results we're seeing among the women. AA girls and women are withering and dropping like flies but no one (aside from a few random folks like us) really cares enough and has the courage to speak out. So bw are at war and they have no support, no allies.
By and large, AA women do NOT support other AA women. The vast majority of AA women are lapdogs for bm and will do anything to another AA woman to get a mere pat on the head from a bm or from the ccbc.
Once again, I don't pay attention to what people say, I watch what they DO, and bw as a group are not doing ANYTHING to protect younger black females. They talk about building black girls self esteem, yet they don't tell these girls about the predators around them. Only a few of us individual bw are speaking out, yet the masses of AAs think it's perfectly natural for bw to keep on having children as if things are normal, as if bw are not at war. This is such madness!
Anyway, this is the main reason that the rest of the society and non-AAs wouldn't lift a finger to assist AA women and I don't blame them at all because AA women, as a group, have the conditioning of the battered women. Relatively speaking, there are obviously only a few AA women who have escaped battered woman syndrome. Even if we could get some support from other quarters, as a group, AA women are going to fight the supporters in order to protect bm, just like those battered women.
Yes, once upon a time, white men were the greatest menace to AA girls and women, but they could be outted because bw didn't try to protect them. But the vast majority of bw ***still*** REFUSE to out black males as their most likely rapers, killers, molesters, batterers, etc. That needs to be said loudly and precisely to black girls and unsuspecting bw. Instead, I keep getting notes from people saying, "There are wm DBRs too." SMH
Now before all of the bw lapdogs come yapping at me, I'm not saying ALL bm are a menace. There is a small percentage of AAEM (african american Evolved men) and I know some of these men and I love some of them. But we all KNOW that a certain proportion of BLACK MALES are the actual perps and an even larger proportion of bm are in silent agreement and will actively protect and defend the perps BECAUSE they're ALL beneffiting from this situation. We have got to be able to teach black girls and unsuspecting bw to clearly see the threat.
Even the AAEMs are beneffiting from this surplus of desperate bw and I think that any AA man who tries to claim that he isn't benefitting is suspect.
@ Aphrodite, re your question above about your friend, I'll respond since you referenced my comment about reciprocity.
Please always remember that when you're dealing with just about any animal,vegetable, mineral that any behavior or tendency that continues is one that is being rewarded. This is right out of the behavior modification rulebook. There isn't much anyone can tell me that I don't know about behavior mod because I used behavior mod techniques with hardcore cases for years. Without realizing it, you rewarded your friend throughout the relationship for mistreating you.
At this point, STOP rewarding the mistreatment. If you really believe that she is a worthwhile person to have in your life (and because she knows your secrets--LOL!), I would suggest the following:
Calmly and without any sympathy (or controlling it) in your voice and your demeanor, you've got to tell her that you want to re-negotiate the relationship, but tell her that from now on, any time she even sounds like she's going to raise her voice or go into a tirade, you are going to leave or hang up the phone THAT INSTANT. Tell her that's not a threat; that's a promise.
She's going to test you, and you're going to have to do what I've said without hesitation. This is critical!
Unless there is organic brain dysfunction, or something similar, most people have been gradually shaped (by rewarding them) to be the way they are, therefore they can be re-shaped if the time, energy, proper strategies and techniques are used and if you can control enough variables.
@Aphrodite
Unfortunately, it is instinctual for men to be attracted to vulnerable young women, or as they call them, jailbait. Only socialization by civilized men in their family or community can suppress it. And even then it doesn't always take. There are a few males in my extended family with this curse who can't point to upbringing.
Something about the development of a boy/man's psyche makes it almost impossible for women alone to guide this socialization, NO MATTER WHAT THEY DO. That is why, IMO, it is pointless to blame a mother for this fault in her son, except possibly for her role in bringing uncivilized men into her children's lives.
@Khadija / Sister Seeking
The Qu'ran of course does not support this misogyny. The prophet Mohammed had a wonderful mutually-respectful marriage with his first wife. And after she died, he continued to treat the women in his life well.
Since this profound example doesn't usually inspire emulation. And activism from the leadership, re: Iman Magid, doesn't bring change, is there hope for grassroots activism? Does this mean revolution in the American MC, with all the disorder that implies?
Respectfully,
--- Aabaakawad
@ Khadija
When I do attend the public meeting I will exercise emotional self-restraint. But here are the point’s I plan to make:
1) I believe in the separation of church and state.
2) I believe that there needs to be some type of screening process for religious non-profits who are seeking a contract with their county or state government.
3) If it is the county’s desire to see its residents, safe, healthy, and prosperous clergy should advise women to in DV cases to contact public resources first.
4) If Muslim women are going to be advised to go to Mosques in which there is some form of a sharia court they should be counseled to retain a lawyer, and that lawyer educates their client at the risks, and consequences of not going through a secular court system.
@ Roslyn
“I think it's unfortunate that you have to direct women away from their spiritual leaders in times of crisis. I think it's natural for many women to seek out their pastor in these situations, and it's unfortunate that no help is forthcoming to them. In the past I've been able to work with some pastors in DV and CA situations. A lot of seminaries these days require their pastors to have training in counseling and some even have advanced degrees in the field.”
“Imam” means nothing more than a leader of salah (prayer). Some masjids stress those requirements you mentioned above but it’s not “nationalized”? I don’t want to paint Imam Magid out as some enabler—I personally believe he is not. For my own sake of mental peace, I’m just telling sisters I’ve met IRL or OL to just go straight to the public source.
@Aphrodite
It is widespread…
In general:
A sister who e-mailed this story and just sent me an update from MSN has said that some are TIRED of feeling like they half to denounce EVERY act of terrorism or DV carried out by a Muslim. My response IRL and OL will be to stop telling the world that we know everything; have all the answers; and are the only solution. You set your self up for this work when you present this image to the world and when clear thinking people see events occurring that indicate otherwise, they are going to blame Islam.
I also think this might eliminate group profiling.
Hello there, Roslyn!
You said, "I think it's unfortunate that you're having to direct women away from their spiritual leaders in times of crisis. I think it's natural for many women to seek out their pastor in these situations, and it's unfortunate that no help is forthcoming to them....
...Of course, you have to carefully screen these people because many churches are still full of the misogynist/chauvinist leaders as well."
Yes, it is a disgrace that it has come to this. Here's the problem: If the victim was unable/unwilling to screen out her abuser, how likely is it that such a woman will screen and vet a "Man of Gawd"? Not likely.
Black folks' houses of worship are mostly rotten to the core. It's already emotionally dangerous for a BW to attend most of these places. It's DEADLY for a BW to go to these places during a life or death crisis.
______________________
Hello there, Aphrodite!
If the person cannot be re-trained pursuant to Evia's instructions, then you're going to have to slowly and gradually back away from this person. An overt "falling out" or abrupt breaking away from her will trigger her taking whatever revenge she can against you---i.e., telling your "business," etc. Whatever you do, DO NOT confide in her anymore!
_______________________
Hello there, Evia!
Guurl...it IS some nauseating stuff. You said, "the FACT is that in a patriarchal world where we have no males protecting
AA women, predator black males are now and will continue to be the GREATEST menace to black girls and women and it's OBVIOUS that MOST bw are just fine with this and are not going to go to war to stop this war on bf."
This is why, for me, the gloves come off with anybody and everybody who's harming BW and girls. Whether they are front-line perpetrators like BM predators, or enablers like so many BW.
Even though I don't like female infighting, I've reached a point where I just don't care. These BM predators and their BF enablers are all on the same team together! They're ALL the same to me. Therefore, they get the same treatment in response.
You said, "AA girls and women are withering and dropping like flies but no one (aside from a few random folks like us) really cares enough and has the courage to speak out."
I'll get "really real" like you did during the Prince vs. Team of Rivals conversation: The reality is that AA women and girls, along with the AA collective, have ALREADY lost this war! That's why the AA collective is in the midst of an implosion. That's why AA women and girls are dropping like flies.
Most of us are NOT going to make it. Much less thrive. Most of us are animated corpses that just haven't dropped to the ground. Yet.
I'm trying to salvage as many BW and girls as possible. I'm trying to pluck a few BW and girls here and there OFF of the conveyor belt to self-destruction.
I consider what I'm doing a "fighting retreat" to salvage those who can still be saved.
You said, "There is a small percentage of AAEM (african american Evolved men) and I know some of these men and I love some of them. But we all KNOW that a certain proportion of BLACK MALES are the actual perps and an even larger proportion of bm are in silent agreement and will actively protect and defend the perps BECAUSE they're ALL beneffiting from this situation. We have got to be able to teach black girls and unsuspecting bw to clearly see the threat."
Fantasy Island needs to be nuked.
You said, "Even the AAEMs are beneffiting from this surplus of desperate bw and I think that any AA man who tries to claim that he isn't benefitting is suspect."
Definitely. This is why there's no response from the AAEMs. The current situation works for them as well as the predators. So, they have no incentive to do anything about the status quo. The reality is that most people are opportunistic, and NOT principled.
_____________________
Hello there, Aabaakawad!
Every woman has to take steps to save, and enhance, her own life.
______________________
Hello there, SisterSeeking/Miriam!
Those sound like some excellent points!
Peace, blessings and solidarity.
Hi Khadija, don't have much to say tonight, but thanks for spreading this valuable information. One day. Sigh.
Tasha212, your story is very similar to mine. I too hope my brother turns out to be a better man.
Khadija, you are so right about helping from a distance. Althoug there is no physical abuse that I know of any longer (others still exist I believe), recently, my mother has taken to defending my father, excusing all those years of mistreatment. It's so ridiculous I can hardly believe it. It's sickening. Makes me want to cut both off and leave them to their misery. And I probably would have already if my son wasn't so fond of my father. It's already tacitly understood that any interaction they have will be chaperoned by me and/or my husband.
Growing up in that kind of household made it very easy for me to know exactly what to look for and what to avoid by all means in a man. The first time I'm hit or abused in any way, is the last time. I'd rather be alone and, in a way, I'm thankful for my mother's example of what happens when that is not your credo.
Greetings, Chi-Chi!
I praise God that you made it through that sort of environment. It angers me when I think of how outrageously COMMONPLACE this sort of mess is.
You said, "The first time I'm hit or abused in any way, is the last time."
More women need to wake up, and make similar resolutions. We are only given ONE earthly life. This is it!
Peace, blessings and solidarity.
Greetings, LaIncognita!
Thank you for your kind words about the post. I truly appreciate it.
Peace, blessings and solidarity.
Khadija,
For those of your readers still following the beheading of Aasiya Zubair by Muzzammil Hassan story, Zerqa Abid, the female cousin of one of Muzzammil Hassan's two ex-wives, has a detailed post about him and his sordid history:
http://zerqaabid.blogspot.com/2009/02/did-we-ever-bother-to-know-muzzammil.html
The comments following her post are comprehensive, introspective, and mostly respectful.
Wishing You Progress,
--- Aabaakawad
Hello there, Aabaakawad!
Everyone: Apparently, the blog author cited by Aabaakawad is a relative of Mr. Hassan's first wife (who was also allegedly abused). I found the following passage from Ms. Abid's post extremely interesting:
"At my return, I warned some community leaders, but the response was not encouraging. People told me that his personal life may be messed up, but he is doing a good job so we should support him no matter what.
This support was so overwhelming that he was presented with awards too. Now the pictures of award ceremonies are coming back to haunt us and some of them are already posted on anti-Muslim blogs after the murder of Ms. Zubair. One of the headlines reads: Bridges TV CEO Arrested for Beheading Wife Received Award from … [name of a prominent national American Muslim Organization]."
Doesn't this pattern sound familiar? Responses of "I'm not in that man's personal business...There are two sides to every story...We can't judge him..., etc." Haven't we seen these responses followed by pictures of some miscreant receiving an NAACP Image Award?
I agree with Ms. Abid. If somebody is mistreating his/her family, it does NOT bode well for how such a person will treat others. Common sense should tell us that. Instead of the criminal-enabling compartmentalization that we promote.
This compartmentalization mess reminds me of the madness of the SOS Band song "Just Be Good to Me" where the singer is crooning that she doesn't care how her guy treats other people. Including how he treats his other women, if I remember correctly. I always hated the jacked-up, anti-woman messages in most SOS Band songs. Even as a pre-teen.
Like I told a dissenting commenter during Part 1 of the "All Colored Folks Who Want to Go to Kansas" post, CHARACTER MATTERS! Sometimes a person's character is a matter of life and death. We need to STOP supporting wicked people!
Peace, blessings and solidarity.
Here for your reading (dis)pleasure, are the lyrics from the S(ounds) O(f) S(tupidity) song, Just Be Good to Me:
Friends tell me I am crazy
And I'm wasting time with you
You'll never be mine
It's not the way I see it
'Cause I feel you're already mine
Whenever you're with me {Ooh...ooh...ooh...}
People always talkin' 'bout
Your reputation
I don't care about your other girls
Just be good to me {Ooh...ooh...ooh...}
Friends are always tellin' me
You're a user
I don't care what you do to them
Just be good to me {Ooh...ooh...ooh...}
You may have many others
But I know when you're with me
You are all mine
Friends always seem to listen
To the bad things that you do
You never do them to me {Ooh...ooh...ooh...}
People always talkin' 'bout
Your reputation
I don't care about your other girls
Just be good to me {Ooh...ooh...ooh...}
Friends are always tellin' me
You're a user
I don't care what you do to them
Just be good to me {Ooh...ooh...ooh...}
La, la, la, la, la, la, la, la
La, la, la, la, la, la, la, la
Just be good to me
Life is a game of chances
So I'll take my chance with you
And you, I won't try to change
We talk about it and I
Never had a piece of you
And to have all of nothing {Ooh...ooh...ooh...}
But just be good to me
In the mornin'
Just be good to me
In the afternoon or evenin', oh, yeah
Just be good to me {Ooh...ooh...ooh...}
I'll give you love, I will smother you
I'll give affection, I won't bother you
I'll be good to you, you'll be good to me, yeah, yeah
Just be good to me {Ooh...ooh...ooh...}
I'm like a cherry pie, I will tie you down
When you need me, I'll be around
I'll be good to you, you'll be good to me
And we'll always be together, be together, ha
La, la, la, la, la, la, la, la
La, la, la, la, la, la, la, la (Oh...)
Just be good to me {Ooh...ooh...ooh...}
(I love you so) La, la, la, la, la, la, la, la
La, la, la, la, la, la, la, la (Be nice to me, be sweet to me)
Just be good to me {Ooh...ooh...ooh...}
(We won't worry, no don't worry 'bout what the people say)
La, la, la, la, la, la, la, la
La, la, la, la, la, la, la, la (We'll be good to each other)
(Ooh, each and every day) Just be good to me {Ooh...ooh...ooh...}"
_____________________
Although, if I remember correctly, the phrase went "I'd rather have a piece of you, than to have all of nothing."
[Can everybody tell that this song REALLY pissed me off as a teenager?]
Unfortunately, the sentiments expressed in this bit of madness seem to be the culturally-approved anthem that AA women are encouraged to adopt. {sigh}
Yes Khadija the first time i heard that song something felt very off and then I realised that not only was the singer saying she didnt care about his other mess, she was actually endorsing him having as many as he wanted at the same time [mind boggles].
not only is the song anti-woman it is an open invitation for debasement. ewwwwwh is always my reaction when it comes on.
Khadija,
I don't remember the song, but those lyrics made me feel sick.
Greetings, Halima & Aabaakawad!
That particular mess was all over the place. From Wikipedia:
"'Just Be Good To Me' is a 1983 single by The S.O.S. Band, which reached #2 on the U.S. R&B charts, #55 on the Billboard Hot 100 and #3 on the Hot Dance Club Play chart that year."
I remember because I recall having many arguments about the song. With me saying things like, "This is bull****. [said loudly---yes, I've been politically obnoxious for a LONG time--LOL!]...Will somebody turn that mess off?...I'm not dancing to that...Who put that on?...Why did you buy that mess?...Don't you know that's a 'crazy woman' song where this broad is ASKING to be dogged out? [said to other young ladies]...Have you listened to the lyrics?"
Halima, you said, "not only is the song anti-woman it is an open invitation for debasement. ewwwwwh is always my reaction when it comes on."
"EWWWWH!" is right. But what bothered me even more is that none of the other young ladies around me noticed, or CARED. I've watched this scenario repeated over & over with degrading "music."
In fact, I've had ongoing debates with a friend who is a songwriter AND a devout Christian over the harm done by the SOS Band. She's in her early 30s. I'm guessing from her statements, that since the SOS Band mess didn't include cursing and invitations to drive-bys (like the modern mess), then it's not so bad.
Like you said, the mind boggles.
Peace, blessings and solidarity.
Khadija,
Perhaps "Just Be Good To Me" is worth a post someday. I'm sure it will elicit a lot of response.
Wishing You Progress,
--- Aabaakawad
Thank you Khadija and Evia,
I will not share anything else with this person. I was tempted to just cut ties, but I have decided to slowly back away as advised and if a situation such as the last one arises, I will implement those suggestions. Thank you so much for the advice and support.
@ Aabaakawad
" Unfortunately, it is instinctual for men to be attracted to vulnerable young women, or as they call them, jailbait. Only socialization by civilized men in their family or community can suppress it. And even then it doesn't always take. There are a few males in my extended family with this curse who can't point to upbringing."
I have no idea how to respond. That makes my blood run cold.
Wow Khadija,
You are a real "stand up" person. I have found some songs, jokes, films maddeningly anti woman, but I usually don't vocalize it depending on my surroundings.
I have heard the song that you are talking about on a certain type of r&b station.
I felt the same way when Fantasia came out with the Baby Momma anthem.
I also read the last blog article posted and I don't understand how now no one saw that this guy was eventually going to murder one of his wives.
When I read that both of his former wives divorced him due to abuse I felt like it would be a natural progression for him eventually murder someone.
I can only imagine what kind of person he was in life and I don't see how he was able to get/retain employees at his TV station because if someone is that violent - I would think that would spill over into other relationships.
This is awful. And that he raised funds from his community to start his business with no oversight. Other people's money. I hope he goes to prison for a long time.
*hangs head bashfully*
I was 6 when that SOS Band song came out, but I remember it well. I liked the song, and I most certainly didn't pay any mind to the lyrics.
I'm a lot more discerning in the music I listen to NOW, but I've assumed that music from my childhood (and even before I was born) was automatically "better" music. I will not make that mistake again. I'm not trying to paint a broad brush onto music of the past, but I understand now that I must be more discerning, period.
Back to the post - it always amazes me how some things OUGHT to be common sense, should be inherent to self-preservation, but we're socialized against it. Specifically, this idea of putting oneself in harm's way trying to save an abused woman. It seems as though women are constantly bombarded with messages of self-sacrificing, compassion, etc. As a woman, you're always supposed to try and help people, even those who can't help themselves (ironically, as a black woman, the messages seem to be more "Do all you can to help the downtrodden black men, but judge the black women for making their bed").
I have a co-worker whose husband is just......trifling. While there's no physical abuse to my knowledge, the emotional abuse, the psychological tear-down of this woman by her husband is incredible. It's like I have a living, breathing soap opera sitting next to me, there's so much drama. We have mutual acquaintances at work (she's friends with them, I know them); one of the ladies is trying to "save" her. And tried to get me involved in it. I initially felt bad because I have no interest in trying to "save" her - it's not that I don't feel compassion for what she has been through, but the woman chooses to stay, even though she would have PLENTY of support should she decide to leave. Why should I be more invested in her deliverance than she is? I hope she sees the light one day, and I will be as cautiously supportive as I can if that day comes. But I decided in my early 20s that I would NOT try and save grown folks, especially to my detriment. Learning to establish the proper boundaries, in all relationships, is one of the most fundamental lessons a woman can learn. I learned it the hard way, so hopefully this post will help someone learn from the experiences of others. Thanks, Khadija!
Hello there, Aphrodite!
You said, "Wow Khadija, You are a real "stand up" person."
Thank you, but I don't know about all of that. That sort of behavior is how I transitioned from being typecast as a "Flaky Artist" to a "Political Nut." It always tickled me how teenage and young adult herd members really thought they could accurately typecast people.
Because I tend to be quiet and reserved (with a dry sense of humor), the "herds" usually typecast me as "shy." So they found it all the more shocking when I would get "loudmouth" about certain things. LOL!
What's Fantasia's "Baby Mama anthem"? I'm curious. I stopped listening to Black music radio sometime around 1990, so I'm blissfully unaware of most of these things. I only get to hear this madness when I'm at the hair salon. Which is how I heard (and was horrified by) Jazmine Sullivan's "Bust Your Windows" song.
[Lord have mercy. Of course, the other patrons were amused by my loud exclamations of: "Oh...my...God. Is she really saying THAT? What is THAT? Who is THAT?" The shampoo girl who was washing my hair calmly told me that "It gets like that, sometimes..." ]
You said, "I also read the last blog article posted and I don't understand how now no one saw that this guy was eventually going to murder one of his wives."
My take on this situation is that most Muslims (particularly the immigrant Muslims from cultures where so-called "honor killings" take place) really don't care if a wife, daughter, niece, etc. is murdered. That is, as long as it's done under family "authority." Which equals being done by a husband or male relative.
_________________
Greetings, Daphne!
You said, "*hangs head bashfully*
I was 6 when that SOS Band song came out, but I remember it well. I liked the song, and I most certainly didn't pay any mind to the lyrics."
Don't be so hard on yourself. Six years old is NOT 13, 16, 19, or 22+ years old. Who thinks about anything before age 13?
Incidentally, I really hope that nobody in this readership financially supported and purchased the "Bust Your Windows" madness. Evey dollar you spend is a vote in support of whatever you buy. A vote in support of its continuation and expansion.
You said, "Why should I be more invested in her deliverance than she is? I hope she sees the light one day, and I will be as cautiously supportive as I can if that day comes. But I decided in my early 20s that I would NOT try and save grown folks, especially to my detriment. Learning to establish the proper boundaries, in all relationships, is one of the most fundamental lessons a woman can learn."
{raised fist salute} I REFUSE to care more than the grown adult who is directly affected by something. And you're right. All of these "You have a duty to play 'Rescue 911'" messages target women, especially BW. Meanwhile, NOBODY is rescuing us!
Peace, blessings, and solidarity.
Hello Khadija,
"Thank you, but I don't know about all of that."
Well I will definitely say that you are brilliant and that I am sure ant book you write will be a bestseller.
"What's Fantasia's "Baby Mama anthem"? I'm curious. I stopped listening to Black music radio sometime around 1990, so I'm blissfully unaware of most of these things. I only get to hear this madness when I'm at the hair salon. Which is how I heard (and was horrified by) Jazmine Sullivan's "Bust Your Windows" song. "
I have heard of J. Sullivan's song but never heard the whole thing. LOL
Fantasia's Baby Momma is a shout out to all the baby mammas out there. I googled the lyrics:
[chorus]
B-A-B-Y M-A-M-A
This goes out to all my baby mamas
This goes out to all my baby mamas
B-A-B-Y M-A-M-A
This goes out to all my baby mamas
I got love for all my baby mamas
It's about time we had our own song
Don't know what took so long
Cause nowadays it's like a badge of honor
To be a baby mama
I see ya payin' ya bills
I see ya workin' ya job
I see ya goin' to school
And girl I know it's hard
And even though ya fed up
With makin' beds up
Girl, keep ya head up
All my
[chorus]
B-A-B-Y M-A-M-A
This goes out to all my baby mamas
This goes out to all my baby mamas
B-A-B-Y M-A-M-A
This goes out to all my baby mamas
I got love for all my baby mamas
I see you get that support check in the mail
You open it and you're like, "What the Hell?"
You say, "This ain't even half of daycare"
Sayin' to yourself, "This shit ain't fair"
And all my girls who don't get no help
Who gotta do everything by yourself
Remember, what don't kill you can only make you stronger
My baby mama
[chorus]
B-A-B-Y M-A-M-A
This goes out to all my baby mamas
This goes out to all my baby mamas
B-A-B-Y M-A-M-A
This goes out to all my baby mamas
I got love for all my baby mamas
Cause we the backbone (of the hood)
I always knew that (that we could)
We can go anywhere, we can do anything
I know we can make it if we dream
And I think it should be a holiday
For single mothers, tryin' to make a way
But until then, here is your song
Show love to my....
[chorus]
B-A-B-Y M-A-M-A
This goes out to all my baby mamas
This goes out to all my baby mamas
B-A-B-Y M-A-M-A
This goes out to all my baby mamas
I got love for all my baby mamas
Hello there, Aphrodite!
Oh...wow...it's actually titled "Baby Mama." {shudder}
Wow...just...wow...{speechless}
................Thanks for answering my question...I had no idea about this...the crazy, dysfunctional, anti-survival ideas that we market to ourselves...wow...
Peace, blessings and solidarity.
@Aphrodite,
You quoted me:
Unfortunately, it is instinctual for men to be attracted to vulnerable young women, or as they call them, jailbait. Only socialization by civilized men in their family or community can suppress it. And even then it doesn't always take. There are a few males in my extended family with this curse who can't point to upbringing.
I also said in the next sentence:
Something about the development of a boy/man's psyche makes it almost impossible for women ALONE to guide this socialization, NO MATTER WHAT THEY DO.
And you replied:
I have no idea how to respond. That makes my blood run cold.
I didn't mean to shock you. There is hope, but we have to be clear-eyed about it. I have looked in vain for the my original source for this, but I think I have found something just as good.
I am a terrible typist, and Google Book Preview does not allow me to cut and paste excerpts, so you all will have to use the following link to see Boys Adrift: The Five Factors Driving the Growing Epidemic of Unmotivated Boys and Underachieving Young Men by Leonard Sax. The relevent parts are pgs 163-170 of Chapter 7, The Fifth Factor: The Revenge of the Forsaken Gods
http://books.google.com/books?id=yg2_ZVMryRUC&pg=PA163
Please read all eight pages, it is worth it. They are small easy to read pages. Much of it is on how all very-long-term successful cultures transfer moral norms through same-gender institutions.
I will quote this paragraph from a boy's school headmaster, Kenneth LaRocque, featured in the book:
It's not enough for a boy to become a man. We want him to become a gentleman. A gentleman doesn't harass girls or women ... interrupt a girl when she is speaking. ... You can't assume that boys these days know these things. But they can be taught. A boy does not naturally grow up to be a gentleman. YOU NEED A COMMUNITY OF MEN SHOWING BOYS HOW TO BEHAVE.
My emphasis.
Wishing you all progress.
Aphrodite,
Evia's been saying the same thing for a while during blog discussions here. She has pointed out that there is NO human society (that she has heard of through her studies or anywhere else) that has ever entrusted the socialization of its boys to women.
The logical conclusion is that there is no society that does this because: It. Does. Not. Work.
AAs are finding this out through empirical experience as we slide into the abyss.
I was shocked when she first said this because it's another example of how far out of touch with functional HUMAN norms the AA collective has become.
Peace, blessings and solidarity.
Back to the beheading issue.
This press release from MAAV is being distributed to blogs to post. One of those blogs, "Muslim Women" [ http://blogs.timesunion.com/muslimwomen ], has been heavy into the issue of domestic abuse of Muslim women.
Notice what is MISSING from this press release:
PRESS RELEASE
February 19, 2009
Muslim Advocates Against Violence (MAAV) condemns the gruesome murder of Aasiya Hassan. We join Muslim advocates and organizations around the country in conveying our deepest sympathies to the family and community members of Ms. Hassan. We urge everyone to learn more about domestic violence within Muslim communities, to become fierce advocates for people who speak out about violence in their lives, and to hold the perpetrators of violence accountable for their actions.
After securing an order of protection against her husband and filing for divorce, Aasiya Hassan, 37 years old, was brutally beheaded and found dead in her hometown of Buffalo, New York on Thursday, February 12, 2009. Two children survive her, ages 4 and 6. After the murder, Ms. Hassan’s husband Muzzammil, directed police to his Bridges TV office where her body was found. He is now charged with second-degree murder.
The irony that a well-respected Muslim leader, the founder and CEO of a Muslim television channel, is an abuser proves how prevalent abuse is despite ones standing within a community and society. It shows how insidious and hidden this problem truly is. We urge the Muslim community to hold their leaders to the highest ethical standards, and to speak out when incidence of domestic violence occurs.
The media is reporting the murder of Ms. Hassan as both an honor killing and the fatal result of domestic violence. However, in the effort to understand how we can prevent future incidents from escalating to this point, the label of this heinous act is not significant. Domestic violence is a problem that plagues women, children, and yes - men, regardless of their religion, ethnicity, orientation or economic status. In a study conducted by the late Sharifa Alkhateeb, 1 in 10 American Muslim women experienced physical abuse. This number does not reflect victims of other equally damaging forms of violence such as verbal, emotional, psychological, sexual, economic and spiritual abuse.
It takes tremendous courage for victims of violence to reach out, to finally ask for help, and to admit that violence is occurring in their lives. For many, it takes years to break the cycle of power and control before seeking help. When any one of us becomes aware of violence in someone’s life, we absolutely must act, and take the matter seriously. We must realize the emotional courage it takes to speak out, and respect the experiences and decisions of the survivor. The question is NOT, “why didn’t she leave before?” rather, “why did all of us let this go on for so long?” and, “how can I prevent this from happening again?”
Despite prevailing stereotypes of Muslims, domestic violence is not an Islamic value, nor is it permissible or condoned within the Muslim community. Many women, men and children continue to be killed as a result of domestic violence; Aasiya Hassan is an unfortunate name on a list too long and too preventable.
We urge all to take this event as wake up call to learn more about domestic violence, and to find out how we can prevent such tragedies. There are state coalitions against domestic violence, community-based organizations, policy think tanks, international programs and faith-based organizations dedicated to ending the pervasive issue of violence against women.
We encourage all domestic violence programs to take a committed step towards learning about and engaging in outreach to Muslim communities, and ensuring their services are culturally and religiously sensitive to all survivors. Similarly, without community support and awareness, efforts and sustainable results of domestic violence programs are limited.
We also caution against diverging away from the justice Ms. Hassan and her family deserves by framing her death within a xenophobic lens that only enforces negative imagery of Muslims. This was not an act of terrorism perpetrated by or penetrating American-Muslim communities, nor was it inflicted due to extremist religious politics and beliefs. Aasiya Hassan’s tragic death joins the innumerable acts of domestic violence committed around our globe that terrorize women, men and children in every community.
For additional information regarding domestic violence, and for technical assistance, please contact the Peaceful Families Project (PFP) at info@peacefulfamilies.org, or visit www.peacefulfamilies.org. PFP is a national domestic violence organization that facilitates awareness workshops for Muslim leaders and communities, provides cultural sensitivity trainings for professionals, and develops resources regarding abuse in Muslim communities.
About MAAV
Muslim Advocates Against Violence (MAAV) is a national network of advocates committed to ending violence against women and supporting healthy communities. MAAV’s mission is to raise awareness, foster dialogue and strengthen advocacy.
For additional information about MAAV, email: maav.info@gmail.
Wishing you all progress.
Khadija: sorry I'm late, but uh...
Although I myself was in an abusive relationship, I empathize yet cannot get involved with helping DV victims (in my case, it would be the blind leading the blind). Now that I'm a mother, there's a crippling fear of ALL men at this point (must learn vetting from scratch). I have to start packing bags AND packing heat...
Daphne:I'm a lot more discerning in the music I listen to NOW, but I've assumed that music from my childhood (and even before I was born) was automatically "better" music. I will not make that mistake again. I'm not trying to paint a broad brush onto music of the past, but I understand now that I must be more discerning, period.
You're not the only one: I have to set a hammer to all but 10 of my CDs before I leave the hood (2 Live Crew, anyone?).
**ahem** I'm overwhelmed, but not for long...will be picking up The Gift of Fear and The Art of War(my spirit is screaming for me to get the latter for some reason).
Thank you again for the heads up.
Rainebeaux,
You're welcome! It's never "late" for these conversations. There's no "expiration date" for the issues that are discussed here.
I would strongly urge you to start with the practical before the theoretical. By that I mean reading The Gift of Fear before The Art of War.
You are quite correct that the first priority is to get yourself and your daughter situated. Playing Good Samaritan with battered women can be EXTREMELY dangerous. The safest thing for any layperson to do is to refer domestic violence victims to the proper authorities and social service agencies. And STAY AWAY from that situation.
I'll keep you and your daughter in my prayers.
Peace, blessings and solidarity.
I just reread my comment and felt the need to clarify: the man who abused me and the co-parent are two separate individuals, but not much time separates them. This is proof of bw needing/having to vet individuals regardless of gender.
Where it stands now, mediocrity in my eyes is a form of abuse--avoiding same is a matter of life and death.
My petition for Protection Order in court was denied because I can't present a Medical Certificate that I was hurt physically.It's unfair. I was verbally and physically abused. It is only in prayer that I take refuge. For women who have been abused for long, do not suffer anymore. Cut the cycle, get a divorce and move on ...
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